This post is inspired by Dave Doolin from Website In A Weekend, someone I massively respect and watch extremely closely to see how he is doing it. Dave made a comment on Nathan Hangen’s site on a post called Those Who Can’t Teach, go and check it out if you can. Anyway back to the post, Dave made a comment in which he said he would take a 90% reduction in traffic if he picked up 3 qualified customers per month. Below is the exact comment made by Dave;
I just raised prices on my installations, topping out at $1800 now.
I’ll take a 90% reduction in traffic to pick up 3 qualified customers per month.
It’s funny how all the top people admit they are voracious consumers of the same sorts of products they sell. They purchase from their competition. At retail prices.
Game on.
Now as some of you may know this site is in the initial stages of becoming a business and I’m learning fast, you have to if you want to succeed and I know that I have to step up my thinking and approach to this which is why I think it’s a good thing I thought about Dave’s response. I thought to myself would I sacrifice traffic and comments to increase my revenue from this site and what exactly do I want from this site?
I asked 8 people who are making money online through a variety of different ventures the same question, before I get into that I just want to say that all of these guys blog and all of these guys make real money online, but most have other sources of income as well as their personal site, but we’ll get into that.
I like watching people and how they do it, especially the top flight, to me they are proving it can be done. It’s not so I can copy their methods, because I believe you should observe and interpret in your own way, but I like that people are out there doing it already. So I asked them all the same question;
‘Would you sacrifice traffic and comments for increased revenue from your website?”
I asked this question of 8 people I believe are best placed to answer such a question, ie people who are making good money online, the sort of people I badger for advice and help like a little brother, anyway back to the response from some awesome and dependable people, just want to add that all these people are earning online, are all seriously busy and ALL responded with in 4 hrs of the email going out, so here are the responses to the question;
”No. But not for the reasons you might think. I play “long ball” marketing, where deals for me often come from friends of friends in certain audiences. That’s why a good volume helps me. Besides, my site is a showcase, not direct revenue.”
”Short answer: Absolutely. Now, this depends on whether the question infers an immediate time frame or not – as well as a finite dollar figure. For instance, selling your website would essentially bring your traffic & comments to zero, but you’d receive “increased” money in return. If it was a matter of a few hundred bucks, I’m not sure if I’d be willing to do just that – even if that represents a figure that is more than I’ve currently made. Now, the opposite is true as well. Let’s say I’d decline to make much money now in return for traffic & comments – but I know that down the line, this choice will make *more* money in the future.
Then it’s quite likely I would accept this proposition. In any case, it still boils down to what makes for the most optimal return of investment measured in dollars. It’s still business. The three passions I have in life: making people laugh, teaching, making money. If I can do the third to the highest extent while still doing the other two in the process… sounds like a winning combination to me.”
”Yes. Comments and traffic are great, but I run businesses not social clubs. I provide value in which 95% is free and 5% is paid. I also do affiliate sales through those same avenues.”
”Absolutely, I would. Let me make an example: My main money site gets only 1000 visitors a month, but I make $3-5k per month off of those visitors. Hot Blog Tips currently gets about 15k views and I ,make about $50per month. Which would you rather have, a site with a great community, or one with literally no community (I blog maybe once a month on my money site) and a full time income? So, asking if I, a business man, would sacrifice traffic and comments for money is a no brainer, I am in this to make money, not friends.”
”Absolutely I would. It would allow me to spend more time with those customers. I would be able to help them better which would lead to more referrals. The commenting and promotion is very much a hamster wheel. I have to run because everyone else is running. It’s a race to the bottom. There’s no profit there. But what can you do? Original Comment Link”
As someone who blogs as part of a business, then unquestionably I would happily trade traffic and comments for increased revenue. You can’t eat traffic or use comments to buy your new car! Some people make the mistake of thinking that traffic and comments are directly related to income, and whilst they may have an influence, it isn’t always the case. For example I have a (very) niche blog that only gets 50 to 60 visits a day, and perhaps gets one comment every couple of weeks, and it earns a steady few hundred Euros every month. I have another site that has 25 times that traffic but it only earns 3 times the income.
Of course, ultimately I’d want a blog with lots of traffic, lots of comments and lots of income!
The short answer is yes, in a heartbeat.
- Interesting
Now I admit as you may have done, I thought I knew what all 8 would say, but interestingly it threw up some curve balls. The big thing I took away from this was the thinking, is this site my core business or is it a platform. Chris Brogan said his site is his show case, I like that idea and it’s something Allyn from BloggerIllustrated has spoken to me about before. So where do I see this site, my platform or my main business? Fact is neither yet because I’m still getting my foot into the door and this site has only just (past 48hrs) started to make money now I have released my tutorial and services and I know there is a long way to go.
I think this whole question throws some really interesting issues into the mix, Nathan for example is his usual no-nonsense style would absolutely take a reduction in traffic and comments in order to make more revenue.
- Ultimately
I think the main thing that I took away from all 8 of these people making real money online in various different ways is that they all treat and run it as a business, which leads me to my question to you, are you addicted to comments or dollars? Having a popular website is great and if that’s what your goal is then great, it’s a fantastic goal to have, but if your goal is to put food in your families belly and that food be bought by your online ventures then you have to think of it as a business and get serious and decide how your website will help you do that.
- Spring Board
Is your website a spring board in which it will showcase your best work, maybe for a book deal or show your skills as a reporter. Or as in many cases is your website going to be part of your main income or ultimately a huge part of your online income? You can’t build a business if you don’t know what you’re building.
What is your website for? Again I want to thank everyone for taking part in this quick but interesting question, lets learn from these guys and each other to make sure we are heading in the right direction.
Please Comment Positively, We Can All Learn From Each Other
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Excellent article, James. One of the best articles you have written yet.
I like Chris Brogan’s answer a lot, even though it differs from mine.
The difference, I believe, is both where he is in his business, and the business he is in.
There’s a curious dichotomy too, between the two Chris and David, who are well-established: they aren’t so worried about it.
Whereas Nathan, Mike, Jordan, Robb, myself, those hungry dogs back in the pack, we’re still finding our way!
Again, this is what it’s supposed to be about.
Now let’s go make some money.
.-= Dave Doolin´s last blog ..Basic Blogging Business: Do you know what you don’t know? =-.
Thanks brother that means a lot coming from you. Yeah that’s exactly how I see it, not that Chris isn’t hungry or David, But they are established where as the rest of us (I’m included myself as success by association lol) are as you say hungry raw animals constantly hunting.
Agreed lets put food on our families table!
Dave, After reading the other answers, I look at this a little differently. While my main site doesn’t get much traffic, I have targeted very specific “buy” terms with it and it gets mostly search traffic. My “blogging blog” (HBT) is still building up a following and I am about to begin to build a list to showcase the products I have in store for my readers, so traffic will be a factor. At the same time, that traffic should be targeted as well…
.-= Keith´s last blog ..Do You Have A Plan =-.
Agreed brother, targetted traffic is where it’s at, that why I’m shifting focus towards search engine traffic. I think if people are searching for answers and they hit your site as a result it’s got to be better than stumbling across a link
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..7 Relaxed, But Great Ways To Write =-.
I don’t make much from my site but at this point I’m building a loyal following and setting myself up for other opportunities. It is all about passive income for me – find good websites and courses that help other people make a living and make a living off the small cut I make, plus ads and commissions.
So no I would not trade the traffic and comments for more money right now because I’m interested in long term relationships built on trust.
.-= JadeDragon@innovativepassiveincome´s last blog ..Reuse eHow Articles =-.
Jade, that was up until about 3 months ago. I have enough content now, and I”m getting ranked, have search coming in, and really have enough “traffic.”
Just don’t have exactly the right traffic yet… or I haven’t found what my current traffic needs.
.-= Dave Doolin´s last blog ..Basic Blogging Business: Do you know what you don’t know? =-.
I guess it depends on how reducing traffic could, in reality, lead to increased revenue. And that, in turn, depends on how you’re making money from the site.
I suspect for many people, traffic and revenue go hand in hand. Say, for instance, that one percent of visitors to the site spent money with you, then the more traffic you recieve, the richer you become.
The other way of looking at it, is to target your site so that it only recieves ‘high quality’ traffic that is interested in your products and keen to spend money – in other words, keep out the 99% that aren’t serious. Easier said than done, though.
I do think that there is an obsession with some people in getting traffic up without actually thinking why they want this. A bit like teenagers on Facebook who are obsessed with getting a huge friends list.
That’s a good analogy Phil, I think you’re right targeted traffic is where it’s at, if your traffic as a whole reduce by 50% but now the ones who are visiting are highly targeted traffic almost pre-sold traffic then that would be 100% better
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Contact Right, Contact Right Part 3 =-.
You definitely need traffic. Because in the long term without traffic you’re dead.
Ultimately, it’s a numbers game.
If you convert 10% of your visitors to customers, then the only way you’re going to sell more stuff is to have more products or sell more to your existing customers.
If you reduce your visitor numbers, your opportunites for selling reduces. So, in the short term yes, you’ll sell more stuff, but if you’ve sacrificied your visitors who are you going to sell to?
Could you imagine Marks and Spencer or Macy’s reducing their number of customers? Ultimately it’s the job of every retailer (whether online or off) to convert browsers to customers – they do that by selling the stuff that people want!
So from our perspective as online entrepeneurs, it’s about having great content and an offer relevant to the visitors coming to the site.
Yeah I agree in part Matthew, but what if the quality of visitor is extremely high (pre-sold looking for answer from your site) versus a friend of yours who always comments?
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Turning From a Blog To A Business =-.
To be honest brother I find myself slap bang in the middle. I’m a writer, not a business, but suddenly I find myself wanting to make money from the writing. So initially I was after comments, community, discussion and interaction. Now I’m thinking well could I use the blog to launch the books that I will write, but haven’t yet? Comments and community certainly could be a big help in that. So I’m kinda stuck in the middle!
.-= Mo “Mad Dog” Stoneskin´s last blog ..Nice Belt Buckle, Occifer =-.
It’s a difficult situation Mo, kind of the reason for this post really. I’m kind of in the same position as you, love getting comments and traffic but now I’m turning it into a business then my thinking has finally clicked into a place which I’m thinking about solving peoples problems and issues they have.
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..7 Relaxed, But Great Ways To Write =-.
I think it is interesting that people who have tons of traffic are saying that it is no that important. If they did not have the traffic I wonder if their answers would be any different or it they would feel differently about the importance of traffic.
Traffic has another effect on the owner of a website; in the early stages especially it provides validation for what you are doing. If you are doing a great job but no one is visiting, you may wonder if you are doing something that anyone cares about. It seems it is as much about the marketing and networking of a site as it is the content but most people do not realize this at the start.
In the long run naturally you want a large amount of traffic from a highly targeted audience as David says. I think that initially there is a threshold of traffic that provides a level of comfort for the owner regardless of income. ultimately though that must translate to income.
Yeah it’s one of those that it’s easier to answer once you’re in the position really. I think traffic is important yes, but it’s the type of traffic I think that could of been worked into the question or maybe it is in the question.
Qualified traffic, ie people looking for answers has got to be better for businss rather those who have found your site from a Stumble Upon link, what do you think?
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You Lusting After It? =-.
Excellent research here James!
I have always played by the notion that marketers are marketers and bloggers are bloggers and to strike the balance between the two is very rare. David Risley, for example, is both. But how many David’s are there?… not many.
but there are literally thousands of marketers out there who make big bucks daily and never reveal themselves in public.
Then there are people with huge, massive communities who are making 10 cents a day with Adsense.
Me, I try to completely separate the two when possible. I want the notoriety of having a social site like Blogger Illustrated, but I also make some bank from my other 200+ sites that no one knows about except my wife.
And, the good news: I do make money from Blogger Illustrated because of the people I have met because of it. That is the long-ball marketing that Chris Brogan is talking about.
AL
.-= Allyn´s last blog ..Introduction To BackLink Stacking And Why =-.
I don’t know Allyn, that was really close to a David Risley compliment!
.-= Keith´s last blog ..New Project: Help Wanted =-.
Ha ha this place is full of love now dude!
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Turning From a Blog To A Business =-.
every blind squirrel finds a nut, and every a-hole has a nice thing to say at least once on a sunny day!
AL
.-= Allyn´s last blog ..The Walmart Blog, A HUGE Failure, Here’s What We Can Learn =-.
Hey Allyn,
Yeah man I have heard you say that before, but until I started selling from this site and turning the whole thing into a business it’s kind of difficult to understand until you are in the position.
Marketing needs a lot more attention for a blogger who wants to earn money that’s for sure.
I like Chris B’s take on this, it’s a long game short term goals don’t secure the future
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You A Headless Blogger? =-.
I really like Dave Doolin’s answer.
If you are in the game to genuinely help others, provide products that are of genuine value to others and really love how it makes you feel everytime somebody thanks you, then it is important that you don’t sacrifice that feeling just for money. In the end, you don’t wanna make money and hate your job.
But yes, money is important as you need to make a living.
So, by receving less traffic like dave says so that you can be of genuine assistance to your visitors on a one-to-one basis, whilst at the same time providing them with products that will genuinely benefit them and make you money, then you have a win win situation.
Its all about the quality of the traffic you recieve and how you treat those visitors.
Great post James
PS: I finaly got round to reading your “7 days to better traffic” – great read… teh fact that it was free is awesome! Maybe you shoudl should start charging for it, it is a business after all! lol
.-= Dave Ackermann´s last blog ..Digital Economy Bill: Why it’s “not great” and how it will affect us =-.
Hey Dave,
Yeah I thought about it, but offering two free tutorials as a sign up gift is getting me great results so I’ll keep it as that for now. Got plenty more coming out dude!
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You Lusting After It? =-.
Looking at the way the comments are developing maybe the question should have been:
“Do you need lots of traffic and comments to make money from a blog?”
Talking about reduced traffic leading to reduced sales isn’t relevant when the question was simply “Would you sacrifice one for the other?”
I don’t imagine there are many bloggers using a blog as a business platform who wouldn’t take up an offer of 25% more income in return for losing 25% of their traffic and comments, assuming that was THE ONLY fallout from the deal.
I’m interested in your answer James:
‘Would you sacrifice traffic and comments for increased revenue from your website?”
Agreed. The question wasn’t really phrased right to get to the real way things work, IMO. The idea of “sacrificing” traffic assumes that you’re going to piss people off in order to monetize. But, that is contingent on attracting the wrong audience to begin with.
.-= David Risley´s last blog ..Crazy Tip For Overcoming Writer’s Block =-.
David, yeah, the question as James put it here is a little out of context from my original comment on Nathan’s rant about being on a hamster wheel.
I’m cool with it because it’s producing a lot of interesting comments.
.-= Dave Doolin´s last blog ..Blogging Alliance – Which way are you reaching: up, down or across? =-.
Yeah brother you’re comment inspired the post, but glad it’s producing great advice
Hi Mike,
Yeah maybe the question should have been different, but who knew the way the comments where going to come out? Hindsite…
Anyway my answer EEEERRRRRMMMMMMM……..
Kind of the reason for the question really, I’ve finally started the process of turning this whole site into a business, it’s not there yet but it’s bringing money in.
Now, without sounding like a politician here I’m kind of stuck for an answer. I’m still finding my feet really site is only 5 months old and I’m about to release (in the next two months) two more tutorials and a course as well as a stack of other things. That said I’m also writing two books (military novels non-related to this site) and a motivational work book.
So traffic and comments would allow me to use the site as a platform/spring board type show case of my work, becuase I believe in it and I’m really proud of what I’m achieveing.
On the other hand targeted traffic (people looking for answers) would result in less comments but it would absolutely (i hope) increase revenue.
I think it’s a question you can’t answer properly until you have either lived through it or decided one way or the other and gone for it.
Mike, how did you promote your books, did you use your other sites as platforms at all?
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Be Different – Guest Post =-.
They’re promoted everywhere. Other people’s sites. through article marketing, Clickbank, E Junkie, advertising etc etc.
Did you self published them? I’m self publishing my motivation one, but the military will hopefully be published by a publishing house, in talks on Monday.?
It’s interesting that almost everyone here pretty much said that they were willing to sacrifice traffic for revenue. When I saw the question you posted I thought to myself “Who wouldn’t do it?” I’m glad to see that most people were honest when they say that they run their blog as a business, not as some altruistic site that’s only there to help people.
.-= Steve Scott Site´s last blog ..Work Anywhere By Being Location Independent =-.
Hey steve,
To be honest I’m surprised at the quality of answers and although they seem the same party line, the answers have given an awesome amount of value.
Good stuff
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..7 Relaxed, But Great Ways To Write =-.
Damn man! Might want to give a guy a heads up you are going to go public with the answer next time…just sayin’.
A little bit more in-depth to what I was saying…
10k un-targeted visitors are not better than 1k targeted. While traffic and comments can be exciting while you watch your blog grow, if you have no plan of attack from a business standpoint…you are just spinning your wheels.
It is all about pin pointing the audience you want to attract and filling their needs with quality products and services. If that means you are attracting a smaller audience but that audience converts at a rate that is much higher…then that is a better business standing.
I completely believe that community and trust are a very vital part to successful blogging. It just takes proper planning to execute a blog that generates income. Comments and traffic do not ultimately pay the bills.
Do you really want the costs associated with running a site that gets hundreds of thousands of visitors a month but with no revenue coming in? I don’t.
.-= Robb Sutton´s last blog ..One Leg At A Time =-.
Hey James, I quite like this article and the responses are very interesting.
But, what really spoke to me was your statement Robb “Comments and traffic are great, but I run businesses not social clubs.” That’s so true, particularly if you are using blogging as part of your business. It’s great to have the traffic and comments, but if you’re not converting and making a living, then it can turn into just an expensive hobby.
Karen
Robb you’re so right, having a fantastic community is great and it is a good way of building a site, but is it a good way of building a business?
I watch you a lot especially your new ventures (not in a creepy donought eating way) because you know how to run a business.
Targeted traffic is absolutely where it’s at, thanks brother
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You A Headless Blogger? =-.
I would give up traffic for money. I mean they are both just numbers, but one pays the bills and the other just looks good on the stats page. I get over 90% of my traffic from Google search and images. These people are looking for information that I provide. They aren’t looking to leave comments or to join my facebook or follow me. Who cares? They want info. I give them that. They are happy. I make money from affiliates. It works great for everyone. I won’t complain.
But…
Some people are so bent on getting traffic and becoming popular that they are losing sight on who their potential paying customers could be. Plus a lot of people are limiting their sales by catering only towards bloggers: Blogger products, widgets, themes… Why do people think that only Bloggers buy products? They are trying to make money, not spend money. What products do you sell that any person or website could use?
“What products do you sell that any person or website could use?”
This guy gets it.
Hey Richard, as Nathan said that I think is the golden nugget of the comments and it’s something I’m going to absolutely ask myself tonight and then implement.
Top work brother, top work. By the way is Jewelry Secrets your main income?
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You A Headless Blogger? =-.
It’s half of my income. I have other sites that are newer but have much more potential and are almost surpassing JS in traffic and money in just 6 months. And I’m also getting into affiliate marketing and setting up smaller niche sites which I think will do really well. And I’m also planning out stages for an actual blog. This is one of the reasons why I’m following bloggers. I’m learning about the market. Seeing what works and what doesn’t.
Actually surprised Chris answered you
Anyway, I get less traffic than you would expect, but I don’t need a ton in order to get what I need. My readers are fairly active, and the ones that are vocal (commenters/RT’ers) are very important to me.
However, the fact is that most people that comment or even read my blog on a regular basis aren’t customers of mine. Many of my customers didn’t even read my blog until after they’d purchased something…very interesting I think.
Traffic is important, but I think what’s more important is a) having good products, and b) having a good network.
As it stands, I could probably close down my blog and still make money online, and in that sense, I’m more closely aligned with Allyn.
One of my favorite bloggers recently told me (and this blogger has a very popular blog) that the ROI sucks…tons of I and very little R.
That’s about the way I feel, and I’m always looking to try new ways of marketing in order to be most efficient.
.-= Nathan Hangen´s last blog ..The Dark & Sinister Science of Authority Blogging =-.
Now there’s a key message if I ever saw one:
“Many of my customers didn’t even read my blog until after they’d purchased something…..”
Critical learning point there guys and girls.
Yeah I think so too man, I think it’s important to become efficient, Nathan are you leaning towards more automation is that what you mean?
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..My Second Novel ‘No Way Back’ =-.
Leaning towards less blogging (bringing in more guest posts), more product creation, and more guest posting.
Marketing, networking, educating…I’m trying to move beyond blogging.
.-= Nathan Hangen´s last blog ..The Dark & Sinister Science of Authority Blogging =-.
ha ha nice plug!
Hey, Nathan,
How did they buy from you, if not from your blog? Wasn’t aware that you offer offline products as well.
Thanks,
Karen
It’s not offline products Kruby. It’s still online.
Take our book Beyond Blogging as an example. Hundreds of people who bought that then reviewed it on their site. Many others referred to it in posts, comments and articles. It’s even mentioned in a very successful bloggers About Page.
So people visit one of those reviews, or that bloggers about page, and buy the book because it looks interesting. They may never have heard of Nathan and I before, but they’ve bought one of our products. It’s probably only at that point that they start to read our blogs.
Mike sorry to hijack this reply but do you think it would have been as succesful without the affiliate?
Of course not.
I think Chris Brogan was right on about your site being your “selling” place. Chris makes so much money from speaking engagements, book sales and other avenues that his blog isn’t his primary revenue source. Whereas most bloggers their blog “IS their income source” so most bloggers would prefer the revenue to traffic. Traffic however can translate to revenue in most cases I would think. Advertisers will pay more to advertise on a blog with 200k visits per month than one with 30k visits per month, so I would think in most cases the two come hand in hand?
The only way very high traffic doesn’t translate to revenue is if you aren’t properly implementing advertising, affiliates or other ways to earn money into your site.
Even if you through Google Ads up and nothing else, a high traffic will bring in more earnings than a low traffic just because of the % rules behind CTR.
.-= Dragon Blogger´s last blog ..Leapfish Macbook Air Giveaway =-.
Brother you raise an interesting point that would have been great to ask Chris himself, do you think people use their site as a source of main income until they get to a place that it becomes their showcase and platform?
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Contact Right, Contact Right Part 3 =-.
I think it´s just a matter of market niches. The traffic will depend on the kind of products i offer. The products have it´s own value.
If i sell most expensive products, obviously the traffic will be lower than if i try to sell cheaper ones.
Maybe the question would be in how many market niches i want to be.
The mistake would be trying to increase the income by increasing the price of a cheaper product. That would reduce the traffic and make the income dissapear. The goal would be unreal and unreachable.
I blog to promote my consulting business, in this moment i don’t blog in order to make money. But, maybe, who knows, in the future.
So you blog to promote your business so it’s a platform rather than a direct source of income?
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You Lusting After It? =-.
Yes. That´s my goal. Until i started bloging i noticed that it can be a source of income. Maybe if i learn more, i’ll try, who knows…
Off topic:
By the way James, I find the image of your 20/7 (top left of every page) rather confusing. First it looks stretched (graphic designer in me) and second, it says “100% Free” but then it asks you to Buy it!
I know what you’re trying to say (the info in my book will get you free traffic), but it sounds like the book is free when it’s not.
Great book by the way. You brought up a lot of interesting topics that I would have never thought about.
Brother It’s being changed don’t worry I picked up on that straight away once it was up so yeah brother I’m on it
After going through the comments and reading what others are saying, I guess the question as simply as you did, leaves a simple answer…. mine is a resounding YES.
Thinking more on terms of different aspects of different projects, it really depends. I work on sites that get 200k views a month and that is what matters because it is a site for advertising, more views = more $.
HotBlogTips is still developing so I need to get more traffic to build a presence.
My products site in more micro niche, so I target the traffic so I can convert sales.
All in all, more traffic, if targeted equals more money. So it is harder to say than just one or the other….
.-= Keith´s last blog ..New Project: Help Wanted =-.
Keith do you know if any of your targetted traffic comment or RT etc? It would be interested to see that comparision although I suspect it would be extremely difficult to work out
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Contact Right, Contact Right Part 3 =-.
Now that was a good post James; interesting to see what everyone thought. Great conversations in the comments too.
I think when it comes right down to it, unless we don’t want to earn money at all, the answer’s going to be the same. Or noses are going to grow. I’d love to be in the position to trade traffic for customers, but since I don’t have anything up yet I’m still very much in the building stage.
That said, due to change by the middle of next month.
Hey Heather so you’re in the same position as me really? Building a site in order to provide answers, then turning it all into a business?
The value in the comments has give me a massive amount of knowledge to take away and think more about the busienss strategies needed
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You Lusting After It? =-.
Nope. I always planned to monetize and I had more plans for that than my normal blog posts lol; just taken me this long to really start to put them into practice properly. I built the site as a business, its just taken a while to get used to the idea/find my feet.
Yea there’s a lot of stuff in the comments here, definitely worth looking into and thinking more about.
Awesome debate, James, you keep gettin’ better !
I can understand all opinions, after all you have to pay that house and feed your family ! As long as you keep producing that value and as long as you help and inspire people with your services, you have all the right in the world to demand top prices for top value ! It’s a shame that still many people think that blogging should be entirely free – great value and revenue does go together !
.-= Mars Dorian´s last blog ..What Super Mario can teach You about Branding ! =-.
Hey Mars,
Yeah man good comparision, good value means good revenue I like that a lot, thinking I should print that off with a big MD next to it, don’t charge me for it though lol?!
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You A Headless Blogger? =-.
Rereading – need to make something clear – I consider myself a “problogger” (whatever that means), but I’m not yet making the rent!
James, you put me in some rareified company here.
.-= Dave Doolin´s last blog ..Blogging Alliance – Which way are you reaching: up, down or across? =-.
Brother you’re in the right place on this page, you’re one of my biggest ”secrets” .
I want to tell the world about your help and what a great site it is, but I’m frightened to death that they’ll all pay attention and learn and then be compeition lol
Seriously though you like Robb and big factors in me learning about this as a business
.-= theinfopreneur´s last blog ..Are You Lusting After It? =-.
James, I don’t have your talent for getting my finger right on the pulse of the community. Probably comes from being highly introverted (although I’m also highly gregarious and social, when I’m in the mood).
Technology changes very quickly. No way anyone in our up-and-coming group is going to be a serious challenge to the masters of the current (blogging) technology.
Our challenge is understanding how blogging is going to change over the next couple of years. And seize those changes fast!
.-= Dave Doolin´s last blog ..Blogging Alliance – Which way are you reaching: up, down or across? =-.
James,
What are you doing?
Starting great debates and getting seriously good comment feedback like this?
Fascinating thread from a simple question… and I am gonna buck the trend… and say NO… what?!
Ok, to a point, I sit on the fence!
I don’t make massive traffic, nor big moolah, yet I have thoughts and opinions..
So, I say no simply because without traffic you got nothing, while I also agree with most here in saying yes, that’s once you have the traffic, gotta get it in the first place, I agree the type of traffic matters, just as the type of site niche, but then it also poses another problem…
Isn’t it what you do with that traffic more important, no matter how small or big?
As it’s a numbers game, are we not looking at the wrong numbers?
What I mean is, the conversion of any traffic you get is what matters… without traffic numbers to test with, get feedback with, how do you get to know what will convert?
Is the question framed in the sense of making more revenue in the way the site currently makes revenue? If so, you can’t swap one for the other, less traffic is less conversion, end of.
If you mean just more revenue in general, how will that happen with less traffic?
Again I understand about it depending on the niche, topic but traffic can be used in so many subtle ways, not just monetising, feedback and stats can be what changes your income in 6 months from the same traffic…even something small you spot now and not think will make much difference.
So I guess, it’s all subjective.
I’d say you have to have traffic to start getting the feedback you need that will ultimately end up starting the revenue in the first place, the only way to benefit from less traffic is better conversions, but who would then want less traffic is their conversions were better?
Food for though this thread.
Got me thinking which is always good.
.-= rob sellen´s last blog ..Commentluv, more than links, comments, traffic, and why you should use it =-.
Hey Rob,
That’s kind of the way I was looking at it, do you build your traffic and rep first then concentrate on who you are targeting or target them from the start? Although that is dependant as you say on your market place. For me site popularity quickly and motivation etc. wait I need to re-adjust my brain pattern just gone dizzy
Well, you will have to get traffic whatever happens, without it you get nowhere, yet rep may not even need to be thought of during that time, not to say you should be silly, but to say it’s not something to worry about, just building the numbers is all, the rep is ok anyway if you do it right.
Target from as early as you can I guess, but then something may change it all, so don’t have a rigid target till you get the big numbers when every single change you may shows some results to improve or whatever, so good to keep an eye on everything in that sense eh
More numbers the bigger that subtle change is noticed… why we can never have too much traffic in that sense.
.-= rob sellen´s last blog ..PR 4 and it means nowt, really… basic SEO is still basic SEO =-.
An interesting way to look at it:
If there was one person out there willing to pay you $10 million for your product, service, etc – wouldn’t the only amount of traffic you’d need is 1?
Would it matter if that person commented or not? If *he* is the type of person who craves engagement, then yes. If not, then no.
Let’s say hypothetically that this person exists and you *could* find them in some fashion at some point. Shouldn’t all your energy be placed in utilizing tools, methods & tactics to do this and present him with your content – and not give much care in anything that *doesn’t* do anything to serve this purpose?
Scale this radical example back to realistic levels and you’ll understand what everyone is talking about here.
.-= Jordan Cooper´s last blog ..Are You Waiting For Your One Big Break? Better Get A Comfortable Chair! =-.
You know that actually made the whole thiing a bit clearer, Jordan for you is your site a platform? from the outside looking in it’s a money maker but seems like a platform to bigger things, could be completely wrong though? Feel free to ignore the question if you don’t want to say, just interested in different peoples approach
Every blog is a platform, though. Direct income, indirect income, it doesn’t matter. It serves a purpose from an ROI perspective no matter what actual way you’re focusing on achieving it.
I guess your perception might be off a bit. Not A Pro Blog itself doesn’t get a heap load of traffic (James, you probably get twice as much as I do) and it makes almost no money for me directly – no products and virtually no services. But what it *does* do is put me in the position to get opportunities – a concept that applies heavily in the comedy industry I’m quite experienced with. Showcasing your talent, highlighting strengths of what you have to offer others, increasing your influence and becoming an asset in any way that can earn you money.
On the opposite end, my Football Manager site (FM-Britain) is more of that “traditional” entity – where it’s designed to drive traffic & interaction while focusing on providing help for a targeted demographic. From there, it turns into direct income by way of product sales.
The difference in approach is that FM-Britain is geared for “micro” transactions (a $12 eBook) in which traffic numbers are a big factor in income earned. Where the purchase is fairly cheap and a “deeper” trust & connection is not needed as much as opposed to clear tangible value – the conversion requires much less on your part. It becomes more of a numbers game.
Not A Pro Blog, on the other hand, is geared for “macro” transactions (such as JV’ing with Nathan & Mike on the Beyond Blogging Project) in which traffic numbers are less of a factor – but the “depth” of a *single* one is MUCH more important. Where the purchase is more expensive and requires A LOT more trust & connection to convert – you need to focus on providing that in as much of a narrow way as possible. Failing to do so in the pursuit of “traffic” may see 10,000 people visit and convert none – as opposed to seeing 200 people visit and converting one.
.-= Jordan Cooper´s last blog ..Are You Waiting For Your One Big Break? Better Get A Comfortable Chair! =-.
Hey brother I got it now, thanks brother. What an amazing amount of value in this post from peoples experience
Jordan,
I thought you were supposed to just write compelling content and the money flows? have I been duped?
AL
.-= Allyn´s last blog ..The Walmart Blog, A HUGE Failure, Here’s What We Can Learn =-.
Lol… damn we all been getting it wrong… again!
.-= rob sellen´s last blog ..Make money online from one of these 95 niches =-.
The underlying question (hinted at by Dave Brogan) is whether this would be sacrificing the long-term to the short-term
I haven’t got to the point to where I’ve developed that kind of traffic yet so I can’t say which I’d rather do. At this point, for me traffic equals money so I’m just trying to build it up. This is an interesting thread and great food for thought!
Thanks for sharing!!
Hey Jarrod, yeah it’s got real value in this post because of the people adding their own thoughts and experience.
I feel that my blog is just the springboard to something better. I don’t really think that I am going to make a lot of money through it and I am really not. That of course doesn’t mean that I don’t take blogging seriously. The problem is just that too many people start a blog thinking they could be easily making within a few weeks. But I believe that blogging is not really about making money. It’s about getting your message out there and being heard by people. Don’t you think?
.-= Julius Kuhn-Regnier´s last blog ..What Traveling through Scotland Taught Me about Blogging =-.
hey Julius,
Yeah of course it’s about your message, but for me anyway, I need to put food on the table so for me it’s absolutely about being a business, that said I think the best way to do any of that is to provide value in everything you do, that way hopefully you can keep the business a moral one
It’s interesting that people see the same thing in different ways and make different philosophies from it and it works just fine for them.
Of course, the best answer will be to have both traffic and revenue – why settle for less?
But then, the higher your traffic the higher your chances of getting those ideal customers.
Excellent post idea, and really the answers do not surprise me, I agree with those that said targeting the correct traffic is key, as mostly having posts and content without any planning are usually just wasted space.
.-= JR ´s last blog ..Website Speed Now A Definite Factor in Google Rankings and 12 Tools to Check Site Speed =-.
Let me also add that whenever one is creating and launching a blog it’s important to realize the end goal, as becoming famous, being a social blogger and purely running a blog to make money are very different animals. Though some things may overlap, the goals are quite different and so the path and tactics will be as well.
.-= JR @ Internet Marketing ´s last blog ..Website Speed Now A Definite Factor in Google Rankings and 12 Tools to Check Site Speed =-.
Hey JR yeah you’re right a lot of the aspects involved do over lap but your focus is different, good point